LR Publisher quoted on Rand Paul in NY Times

From the Editor:

I was interviewed by the New York Times last week. They called wanting some background information and further contacts on a story about the Paul family.

The article is titled "For Paul Family, Libertarian Ethos Began at Home". The reporter is Mark Leibovich. It's been picked up by the Seattle Times and a number of other publications.

Here's a taste:

While Mr. Paul’s laissez-faire views produced a family of likeminded thinkers — “We’re all on board,” says the oldest son, Ronnie Paul — they inspired the middle child, Rand, to follow his father’s career path, first into medicine and now politics. If he prevails in November after winning the Republican nomination for a Senate seat in Kentucky last month, he and his father would form a two-man libertarian dynasty.

And here's the relevent backgound, and my quote:

Friends of the family describe a traditional household with early American décor and the frequent aroma of Mrs. Paul’s chocolate chip cookies, if not fish sticks. They have lived since July 4, 1968, in the same middle-class enclave of Lake Jackson, where the streets are named for trees, flowers and fauna (the Pauls live on Blossom). They owned a series of collies (Julie, Kippy and Cricket) and a Maltese (Liberty), and the kids were expected, though not required, to feed the pooches, make their own beds, clear their own dishes from the table and not talk back to their elders.

“They were a very Brady Bunch-type American family,” said Eric Dondero, a longtime former aide to Ron Paul. “As different as their politics are, their personal life was very normal.”

Calculation of the Moment of Inertia

Dear CR4 Forum Members,

Yesterday I was scrolling through few cr4 links and I saw one topic HOW TO CALCULATE MOMENT OF INERTIA. I have opened and wanted to read.

Before I read the link suddenly vanished. I did not notice on what date it was included. I tried to locate through sea

Genetics & the Jews | Gene Expression

The 2,000 year dance between the Jewish people and Western civilization has spawned many questions of scholarly interest. A relatively minor point, though not trivial, has been the issue of the biological relatedness of the Jewish people, and their relatedness to the nations among whom they were resident. This particular point became more starkly relevant with a scientific understanding of human genealogy and genetic relationship in the 18th and especially 19th centuries, but its root can be traced back to antiquity. Jews are not simply a set of individuals who espouse a belief in the God of the Jews, or hold to the laws of the God of the Jews. Rather, one aspect of Jewish identity is its collective component whereby the adherents of the Jewish religion also conceive of themselves as a particular nation or tribe, and therefore bound together by a chain of biological descent. Ergo, the traditional assertion that one is a Jew if one’s mother is a Jew.

Of course these issues can not be understood except in light of a complex historically contingent sequence of events. Our understanding of what it means to be Jewish today, or the understanding of Jews themselves as to their own identity, is the outcome of a long process where self-identified Jews interacted with the broader milieu, as well as evolving in situ. In other words, the Jewish people and the seeds of the Jewish Diaspora were shaped by developments within and without the Jewish culture, and these developments left an impact on the genes of the Jewish people. Contemporary groups outside the “Jewish mainstream,” such as the Beta Israel, Bene Israel and the Karaites, but with an acknowledged connection to Judaism, are windows into other faces of being Jewish besides that of Rabbinical Judaism.

And yet it is descents of the adherents of Rabbinical Judaism, the Judaism of the Pharisees, which we think of when we think of Jews (even the non-Orthodox traditions emerged out of a cultural milieu where Orthodox Judaism was normative). The vast majority of the Jews of the world trace their lineage back to the groups who organized their lives around not just the Bible, but also the Talmud, and subsequently commentaries and rulings by rabbis who were trained in the Talmud. Today these Jews fall into three broad groups, the Ashkenazim, Sephardim and Mizrahim. The Ashkenazim are rather easy to define, as they are the Jews of Central Europe who have been so prominent over the past few centuries. Though it seems likely that in the first millennium their ancestors were to be found along the Rhine, more recently their center of gravity has been in Central & Eastern Europe, in particular Poland and Lithuania. The Sephardim were originally the Jews of Spain, but after their expulsion in 1492 they settled in the Ottoman Empire, and to a lesser extent in other regions of Europe such as the Netherlands. A major confounding issue with the modern Sephardim is that in the Ottoman lands they encountered and interacted with preexistent Jewish communities, who often maintained a distinctive identity subsequent to the influx of the Sephardim. Though in most cases, such as in Morocco and Syria, the Sephardim became culturally dominant and assimilated the indigenous Jewish community into their identity (though they often abandoned Ladino, the language they brought from Spain, for the local lingua franca), in other cases two distinct Jewish communities were coexistent down down to the modern era (e.g. Greece). Finally, the Mizrahim are Jews of the East or Oriental Jews, those Jews whose ancestors hail from Muslim lands where the Sephardim were never a presence. To a great extent the Mizrahim identity is a recent catchall constructed to identify a real dividing line between those groups which are the products of the Sephardic-indigenous synthesis, such as the Moroccan Jews, and those which are not, such as the Yemeni Jews. Often all non-Ashkenazi Jews are referred to as Sephardic because of a common religious liturgy which binds them.

But naturally it gets more complicated than this. Between the rise of Islam and Christianity as the dominant religious civilizations in which Jews were embedded and the Enlightenment Rabbinical Judaism had established a modus vivendi. Jews were a corporate entity, a minority subordinate to the majority, whose relationship with the majority was mediated through eminent individuals who spoke for and had power over the community. Though often fraught in the execution in the abstract the position of Jews within pre-modern political units was not controversial; Jews were subjects with obligations, often a useful minority for potentates. They were not citizens with rights and responsibilities. Over the past few centuries that has obviously changed. The French Revolution and the emergence of the idea of a nation-state where all citizens have equal rights and responsibilities before the law, along with a scientific concept of race, complicated the Jewish relationship with the societies in which they were resident, particularly in Europe (though pan-Turk and pan-Arab nationalism were analogous and resulted in similar problems of identity). Despite phenomena such the Spanish fixation on “cleanliness of blood”, as well the Jews self-conception as the descendants of Israel, it was in the 19th century that the idea of a Jewish race with very specific and determined biological qualities which were heritable came to the fore. The Nazi total extermination program stood in contrast to previous assaults on the existence of Jewish community, where conversion to Christianity, and assimilation more broadly, were plausible goals. The Nazis aimed to eliminate not just the culture of the Jews, but their very biological existence. Ironically assimilated European Jews themselves internalized this sense of their racial/national distinctiveness, evident even in those with no religious aspect of Jewish identity at all such as Sigmund Freud. This explains the secular nature of the original Zionist project, whose aim was to create a national homeland for the Jews as a people, and so normalize them as a nation among nations, rather than being among the nations (this was a project which religious and assimilationist Jews initially opposed).

With the Holocaust, and the post-World War II rejection of racial nationhood, the often pseudo-scientific practice of measuring and categorizing people according to skull metrics, and more legitimately blood groups, fell into disrepute. Some scholars began to reconfigure the Jews not as a biological descent group, but as a religious ideology or confession which eventually became an ethnic identity. The most extreme proponents of the cultural model presumed that Jewish groups emerged through cultural diffusion and religious proselytization. The Jews of Poland were Poles who adopted Rabbinical Judaism. The Jews of Morocco were Arabs or Berbers who adopted Rabbinical Judaism. And so forth. In other words this school transformed Jewishness into what the German Reform movement had attempted, making of Jews just another religious confession with no ethnic connotations (and therefore entailing a reinterpretation of some aspects of Chosen Peoplehood).

But the pendulum has swung back, in part thanks to the rise of genetic science, and in part broader currents in the Jewish world. In regards to the second I will note that the American Reform movement has pulled back from its more aggressive accommodations with the sensibilities of gentiles. Of particular relevance for the topic at hand, Reform Judaism has reversed its rejections of the idea of Jewish nationhood. I suspect this is in large part because American Jews, and Jews in Western nations more generally, feel less need to prove that they belong by aligning themselves self-consciously to mainstream conceptions of religious identity as anti-Semitism has declined.

And now we come to genetics. The genetics of Jews are a large set of related fields. Much of it is motivated by medical considerations, in particular “Jewish diseases” such as Tay-Sachs. Though the ultimate aim of much research is to clarify population stratification in association studies, over the past few years there has been a great deal of light shed on the possible origins of and the relationships of Jews to each other and other populations. Originally the focus was on uniparental lineages, male and female markers passed through the Y chromosome and mtDNA respectively. The general results of these were that both the extreme scenarios of total replacement and pure cultural diffusion are false. On the one hand Jews across the world by and large share unexpected genetic affinity which one would not predict from geography, but only from their common religious-ethnic identity as Jews. But Jews also cluster geographically in a way that is reminiscent of the gentile populations among whom they have settled, suggesting either independent evolution after an initial separation and/or admixture with the local populations.

jewpc2One of the most popular posts on this weblog focuses on the differences between Ashkenazi Jews and gentiles, in particular peoples of European descent. The figure to the left illustrates that white Americans who are gentile or Jewish are rather easy to distinguish genetically from each other. That Jews exhibit a particularly distinctive genetic signature may not be all that surprising, considering that medical geneticists have long known that there are diseases which are biologically rooted and heavily overrepresented among this population. Distinctive traits imply distinctive genes. And the demographic history of the Jewish people as attested to in the literary records can be fitted rather easily within the framework of many of the results coming out of the genetic studies.

But what about the issues I mooted above in regards to the divisions among the Diasporic Jewish community? A new paper in The American Journal of Human Genetics takes a stab at attempting establish a set of relations between different Jewish communities, as well as other populations which they may have admixed with. Abraham’s Children in the Genome Era: Major Jewish Diaspora Populations Comprise Distinct Genetic Clusters with Shared Middle Eastern Ancestry:

For more than a century, Jews and non-Jews alike have tried to define the relatedness of contemporary Jewish people. Previous genetic studies of blood group and serum markers suggested that Jewish groups had Middle Eastern origin with greater genetic similarity between paired Jewish populations. However, these and successor studies of monoallelic Y chromosomal and mitochondrial genetic markers did not resolve the issues of within and between-group Jewish genetic identity. Here, genome-wide analysis of seven Jewish groups (Iranian, Iraqi, Syrian, Italian, Turkish, Greek, and Ashkenazi) and comparison with non-Jewish groups demonstrated distinctive Jewish population clusters, each with shared Middle Eastern ancestry, proximity to contemporary Middle Eastern populations, and variable degrees of European and North African admixture. Two major groups were identified by principal component, phylogenetic, and identity by descent (IBD) analysis: Middle Eastern Jews and European/Syrian Jews. The IBD segment sharing and the proximity of European Jews to each other and to southern European populations suggested similar origins for European Jewry and refuted large-scale genetic contributions of Central and Eastern European and Slavic populations to the formation of Ashkenazi Jewry. Rapid decay of IBD in Ashkenazi Jewish genomes was consistent with a severe bottleneck followed by large expansion, such as occurred with the so-called demographic miracle of population expansion from 50,000 people at the beginning of the 15th century to 5,000,000 people at the beginning of the 19th century. Thus, this study demonstrates that European/Syrian and Middle Eastern Jews represent a series of geographical isolates or clusters woven together by shared IBD genetic threads.

The major limitation of this study that I can see is that two very numerous and interesting groups of non-Ashkenazi Jews, Moroccan and Yemenis, were not included. Yemenis in particular are of interest because there is some historical reference to kings of Yemen who adhered to the Jewish religion, and so implicitly may have brought over substantial numbers of South Arabians to the religion. The studies I have seen about the genetics of Yemeni Jews are mixed in regards to whether they exhibit more affinity with other Jews, or with non-Jewish Yemenis. But set next to the treasure trove of results that’s a minor complaint. Quick review of the groups in the study:

Ashkenazi – easy, Jews of Central Europe

Iraqi Jews – Mizrahi, presumably Jews who descend from the Babylonian community which dates back to the First Exile

Iranian Jews – Mizrahi, should be derived from the Babylonian Jewish community. For most of history after the conquest of Babylon by the Persians Mesopotamia and the Iranian heartland were integrated into one political unit. The the division between Mesopotamia and Iran was fixed after the Ottomans managed to hold what became Iraq against the attempts by the Safavid dynasty of Persia to reclaim it in the 16th century.

Syrian Jews – Sephardic, but a compound of ancient Levantine Jews who date back to Roman antiquity and post-1492 Sephardim. The native Syrian liturgical tradition apparently persisted down into the modern period before its recent extinction

Turkish Jews – Sephardic, but a compound of Anatolian Jews who date back to Roman antiquity and post-1492 Sephardim

Greek Jews – Mostly Sephardic, a compound of Greek Jews who date back to Roman antiquity and post-1492 Sephardim (note that Greece was part of the Ottoman Empire until the 19th century)

Italian Jews – I believe this study classes them as Sephardic, but the origin and nature of this group is ambiguous. The Jewish community of Italy may date back to Roman antiquity, and so lay outside of the Ashkenazi-Sephardic dichotomy, but operationally it has been influenced by the pan-Mediterranean peregrinations of the Sephardic Diaspora

In fact the last point, that different Jewish communities have interacted and influenced each other, is a general truth. Persecutions of Jews during the medieval period as far away as Germany and Spain resulted in infusions of new migrants into the Jewish community of Kerala in South India as an extreme case. Just as there was an Islamic world which stretched from the Atlantic to the borders of China, and a Christian world which spanned Spain and Russia, so the Jewish world stretched from its heart in Central Europe and the Middle East, all the way to far flung outposts such as Kaifeng in North China and Kerala in South India. But powerful streams of cultural interconnectedness do not necessarily entail a great deal of gene flow.

Let’s go to the results as illustrated in the figures. First a table which shows pairwise genetic distances between the Jewish populations enumerated above and selected groups from the HGDP database. The numbers above the diagonal represent Fst, in other words the proportion of genetic variation within the total population as defined by the row-column pair which is between population. The bigger the number, the greater the genetic distance between the two populations.

jewsFST1

Since I had to shrink the figure some, here’s the text which describes the gist of these results:

These findings demonstrated that the most distant and differentiated of the Jewish populations were Iranian Jews followed by Iraqi Jews (average FST to all other Jewish populations 0.016 and 0.011, respectively). The closest genetic distance was between Greek and Turkish Sephardic Jews (FST = 0.001) who, in turn, were close to Italian, Syrian, and Ashkenazi Jews. Thus, two major groups were identifiable that could be characterized as Middle Eastern Jews and European/Syrian Jews, an observation that was supported by pairwise FST and by phylogenetic tree analysis….

The Turkish and Greek communities were operationally nearly unified until the independence of Greece 150 years ago, so the small distance makes sense. It is notable that the distinction in terms of genetic distances maps onto that between the Roman and Persian Empires, where two Jewish communities emerged with different loci, Mesopotamia and the Palestine-Alexandria axis, respectively. Syrian Jews, who were within the boundaries of the Roman Empire, are more similar to European Jews than Iraqi Jews to their east. Though this may be due in part to the influx of Sephardim from Spain within the past few hundred years.

But Fst numbers can be hard to interpret in a gestalt fashion. So let’s look at PCA plots. They filtered the SNPs for the most ancestrally informative ones; i.e., ones which exhibit lots of between population difference. With these SNPs they extracted the largest independent components of variation. Note that the difference between PC 2 and 3 is small in magnitude, and so both are of interest. First, here are the Jewish groups in aggregate as they relate to other HGDP populations:

jewfig2a

No surprise. Jews span Europeans and Middle Easterners. But let’s drill down to a finer grain. They also used the PopRes data set, which from what I recall is a bit more cosmopolitan than the HGDP one. I’ve added some clarifying labels.

jewfig2b

The above changes nothing really in how we understand the relationships of Jews, in particular Ashkenazi Jews, to Europeans. Roughly, Jewish genetic relatedness to European groups tracks how strongly influenced by Rome a region was. Jews are closest to Italians, least close to Finns and Russians. Also, remember to be careful about PCA plots; from what I can gather these dimensions fall out of the set of SNPs designed to maximize between population differences between the Jewish groups so as to increase the power to distinguish Jewish clusters.

Going back to the HGDP sample, you see similar patterns.

jewfig2c

jewfig2d

Iranian and Iraqi Jews, Jews who were not touched by the Sephardic Diaspora, or, the Roman Empire, are distinct from the Jewish groups to their west. In fact it is interesting to observe that the various Levantine Arab groups are rather close to Syrian Jews when set next to the Iraqi and Iranian Jews, at least in total genome content.

Another way to look at the variation is through Structure, where there are K ancestral groups, and individual genomes are conceived of as a synthesis of K groups.

jewstruct

The Structure plot confirms that Ashkenazi Jews are more European than other Jewish groups, and Iranian Jews the least European. This influence of geography, or isolation by distance, shows up in other studies. But it should be weaker or non-existent in a perfectly cosmopolitan Jewish Diaspora where distance is no consideration. This model seems false. The most plausible explanation for the patterns here, supported by uniparental lineages, is that local Jewish populations have admixed with surrounding populations. Of course it could be that Ashkenazi Jews went through a population bottleneck and became a highly endogamous inbred community, so that genetic drift resulted in their uniqueness. But in that case they should show up as distinctive as the Kalash of Pakistan, who may be thought to have formed their own “micro-race” through genetic isolation.

Switching back to a big-picture summary of the genetic relationships, here’s a phylogenetic tree which was generated with the Fst numbers above. I think these should be viewed with caution, as trees like this are sharp and discontinuous by their nature. Even the authors observe that these Jewish groups, as well as human populations in general, have been characterized by gene flow and admixture over time, so that the assumptions which underly some of these representations are idealizations. Trees are invariably claimed to be robust, and yet somehow I’ve seen a really wide range of trees across different studies contingent upon the marker set or technique for the same set of populations quite often.

phylotree

Finally, the authors examined the degree of identity by descent (IDB) across the genome of the Jewish groups. IDB just refers to the fact that a region of the genome is identical with another because they’re descended from the same original copy. Siblings for example have huge regions of the genome identical by descent because each parent contributes one half of the offsprings’ genome. Over the generations the correlations of genetic variants across a physical strand are broken up by recombination. If two individuals who are putatively not related have long regions of the genome which are identical by descent that suggests that they share a recent common ancestor whose genomic contribution hasn’t been diluted by too much time and recombination.

Figure 3 of this paper summarizes the main IDB results. In panel A the red bars are Jewish-Jewish comparisons, yellow Jewish-non-Jewish, and blue non-Jewish-non-Jewish. Panel C plots the genetic relationships adduced from the IDB results on a 2-D plane.

figIDB2

Jewish groups share a lot of the genome identical by descent. Additionally, there’s a general agreement with the other results as to which groups are close to each other. They note in the text that the segments identical by descent among Jews are rather small, which implies that recombination has broken up the large blocks. So that means that a high proportion of Jewish-Jewish IDB is a function more of many common ancestors deep in the past, rather than a few more recent common ancestors. Ashkenazi Jews in particular exhibit increased sharing of the genome across short blocks as opposed to longer ones, suggestive of a demographic expansion from a small population. Genic regions were was also moderately enriched around the loci which were IDB, a possible indication of functional commonalities across Jewish populations. If you’re interested in genes which Jews tend to share IDB, here they are a list:

tables6

After all that where are we? I think this section of the discussion addresses the broad brush findings:

The Middle Eastern populations were formed by Jews in the Babylonian and Persian empires who are thought to have remained geographically continuous in those locales. In contrast, the other Jewish populations were formed more recently from Jews who migrated or were expelled from Palestine and from individuals who were converted to Judaism during Hellenic-Hasmonean times, when proselytism was a common Jewish practice. During Greco-Roman times, recorded mass conversions led to 6 million people practicing Judaism in Roman times or up to 10% of the population of the Roman Empire. Thus, the genetic proximity of these European/Syrian Jewish populations, including Ashkenazi Jews, to each other and to French, Northern Italian, and Sardinian populations favors the idea of non-Semitic Mediterranean ancestry in the formation of the European/ Syrian Jewish groups and is incompatible with theories that Ashkenazi Jews are for the most part the direct lineal descendants of converted Khazars or Slavs. The genetic proximity of Ashkenazi Jews to southern European populations has been observed in several other recent studies.

Early history matters, and what these findings point to is that a division between western and eastern Jews which falls along the lines of Roman-Persian political division exists today even after 2,000 years. In terms of both culture and genetics there is “first mover” advantage. Even though only a minority of the population of the United States is of English origin, the vast majority of Americans speak English, and adhere to cultural traditions of English provenance. Similarly, admixture events early in the history of a group may have an outsized effect contingent upon later variations in population size.

Focusing more on specific cultural and historical parameters the authors note that what was Jewish in the time of Augustus was very different from what was Jewish in the time of Charlemagne. By the time of Charlemagne the Judaism of the Pharisees had marginalized other groups (excepting to some extent the Karaites). In the time of Augustus Jews were divided between different sects and persuasions, and there was a welter of diversity. Additionally, in the marketplace of Roman religion Jews were a moderately entrepreneurial group. The dynasty of Herod himself was of convert origin. There was a wide spectrum of Jewish religious practice and belief, from the near monastic isolation of the Essenes, to the engaged but separatist Pharisees, and finally to the wide range of more syncretistic practices which fall under the rubric of “Hellenistic Judaism.” Many scholars assert that it was from the last sector which Christianity finally arose as a Jewish sect, and that Christianity eventually absorbed all the other forms of Hellenistic Judaism. Judaism of the Pharisees, which became Rabbinical Judaism, and more recently Judaism qua Judaism, was shaped in large part by having to accommodate and placate the dominant Christian and Islamic religious cultures in which it was integrated by the early medieval period. Conversion to Judaism from Christianity or Islam was often a capital crime (though conversion from Christianity to Judaism was not forbidden in Muslim lands, while presumably conversion from Islam to Judaism in Christian lands would not have been, though few Muslims lived in Christian lands). So after 500 A.D. it seems that what may have occurred was that a Jewish Diaspora characterized by geographically determined genetic diversity, despite some common original Levantine origin, was genetically isolated from surrounding populations. This explains why there seems relatively little influx of Slavic genes into the Ashkenazim despite their long sojourn within Poland-Lithuania and later the Russian Empire. In contrast, the Roman Jewish community was already large in the days of Julius Caesar, and presumably intermarried with the urban proletariat of diverse origins.In an ironic twist these data suggest that modern Jews, in particular the Ashkenazim, but to a lesser extent the Sephardim as well, share common ancestry with gentile Europeans due to the unconstrained character of the pagan Greco-Roman world which Jews were to a great extent strident critics of. Contra Tertullian Athens had much to do with Jerusalem.

Image Credit: Wikipedia

Citation: Atzmon, G., Hao, L., Pe’er, I., Velez, C., Pearlman, A., Palamara, P., Morrow, B., Friedman, E., Oddoux, C., & Burns, E. (2010). Abraham’s Children in the Genome Era: Major Jewish Diaspora Populations Comprise Distinct Genetic Clusters with Shared Middle Eastern Ancestry The American Journal of Human Genetics DOI: 10.1016/j.ajhg.2010.04.015

CSCs responsible for metastasis identified

Cancer stem cells responsible for metastasis identified: HK study, Xinhua News Agency, June 4, 2010. Excerpt:

Hong Kong researchers have identified a subset of cancer stem cells responsible for metastasis in human colorectal cancer which can help better predict the prognosis and design a more suitable treatment for patients, according to a study made public by the University of Hong Kong on Friday.

The researchers from the university's medicine school discovered that cancer stem cells with a surface marker CD26, which marks a subset of cancer stem cells with metastatic capacity, are present in all terminal colon cancer cells and all metastatic cancer cells.

This news item is about the publication: A Subpopulation of CD26+ Cancer Stem Cells with Metastatic Capacity in Human Colorectal Cancer by Roberta Pang and 13 co-authors, including Wai Lun Law, Ronnie T Poon and Benjamin CY Wong [photos of authors], Cell Stem Cell 2010(Jun 4); 6(6): 603-15. [Summary][Twitter entry][Commentary][FriendFeed entry][Science Pond entry].

Brain Develops Differently in Fragile X Syndrome

(HealthDay News) -- Brain development in very young boys with fragile X syndrome differs from that in boys without the genetic disorder, a new study has found.

Fragile X syndrome, which is triggered by a mutation in a gene on the X chromosome, is the leading cause of inherited intellectual disability and autism. Though the syndrome affects about one in every 4,000 people, males with the disorder experience more significant symptoms than females.

U.S. researchers used high-resolution MRI to monitor long-term changes that differentiated the brain anatomy of 41 boys with fragile X syndrome and a control group of 21 healthy boys and seven other children who were experiencing developmental delays not caused by fragile X syndrome. Read more...

Immunice for Immune Support

Pensacola Beaches are Open: Get the Latest Info

Get the latest information on Pensacola beaches.
If you don’t find enough info at the link above, check the travel advisory page on the VisitFlorida.com web site. They are doing a good job of keeping their information current.
As of today, June 4, 2010 the Pensacola beaches are still open and safe. A few tarballs have been [...]

14 Best Beaches for Snorkeling in Florida

Many visitors to Florida beaches enjoy snorkeling and are looking for a good snorkeling spot close to where they’ll be staying. Lots of Florida residents are always on the lookout for a new place to put their face in the water as well.
So I’ve compiled some really helpful information for those looking for a snorkeling [...]

Un-learning And Other Neat Stuff: An Interview With Theodora and Zac

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Viet Nam Junk
Our junk moored on the beach at Monkey Island, near Halong Bay, Vietnam

Recently, I conducted interviews with Theodora Sutcliffe (Travels with a Nine Year Old) and her 9-year old son, Zac (The 9-year-old strikes back). Though Mom calls him Z, I asked his preference – it’s Zac. (Guess Moms get to call you by whatever name they choose. Comes with being a Mom.) Each was given a similar set of questions to answer. I hope you enjoy their replies.

Zac: In the blog (Travels with a Nine Year Old), your Mom has written: “…since he was small we’ve talked about taking a year out to travel the world when he is nine. Now we’re finally doing it.” Why did the two of you choose age nine for this journey?

Well, for starters, it was a 24-karat golden opportunity since Mum had the time.

Well, for starters, it was a 24-karat golden opportunity since Mum had the time. We always talked about it. We first started debating on it when I was seven. However, I didn’t want to do it then. I felt like I wasn’t ready to spend a year travelling round the world. So Mom said, “Alright then, maybe when you’re nine.”

Zac with pack
A brand new backpack!

Theodora: From a mother’s perspective, why was this odyssey important at this time in Z’s life?

I think as a parent considering long-term travel with a child, or children, you are caught between two stools. You want them to be old enough to remember it and participate in it, and I certainly wanted Z to be able to actively participate in activities such as diving and trekking. So that gives you a minimum age. And I think for a teenager, or a child approaching that age, intense travel as a family might be absolute hell. At that age you really want to be finding your own space, forming your own relationships, and shaping yourself as a person removed from your family. So there’s a maximum. More immediately, the time was right in my life in January 2010. And he personally felt ready to do it, which he didn’t a couple of years ago.

Zac: If I’ve paid attention correctly, you’ve been traveling since mid-January (2010). Have you felt homesick for anything or just enjoying the adventure?

Indeed I have been feeling homesick at times. Most of the time it comes up when I’m bored or something just gets me thinking about home. I haven’t been bored that many times. But when Mom took a dive course and left me out of it I was a bit bored. I feel homesick for my best friend, Fred, and for England, because I do miss being back in England for some awkward reason, which I don’t even know.

Theodora: You write very lovingly about traveling with Z and the assorted adventures, mishaps, and such. Has anything been a true test of patience yet?

LOL! I’m surprised you didn’t ask him this!

In terms of travel per se there has been no unpleasantness which hasn’t been counter-balanced by the benefits, or actually quite funny at the time. Neither of us has been significantly ill. We haven’t been robbed. We haven’t been stranded anywhere hideous. So I’ve never had the “OMG what am I doing? I want to go hoooome!” moment, and nor, I think, has he.

The exchange that is seared into my memory is me saying, “Look. What exactly is your problem here?!” He took a deep breath and said, “The problem, Mom, is YOU,” and launched into a recital of everything I had done wrong EVER. Going back about five years…

We’ve also always got on very well. Since Z was a baby, he’s had a very chilled, calm temperament, a high pain threshold and low requirements for sleep. He’s always traveled well, been very articulate and found it easy to talk about his feelings. So as a travel companion, I knew it was going to work.

However…. We had a real humdinger of a row in Luang Prabang, Laos, which has been sitting in my drafts file for a while. I was trying to get him to write some postcards. When he wants to, he can be absolutely stubborn as a mule. He’ll change the subject, stonewall, ignore, ignore, ignore, ignore… He said writing postcards made him homesick. I said he was making up excuses because he didn’t like handwriting. We ended up sitting on a wall by the Mekong bickering, with passers-by looking pityingly at him and disapprovingly at me. The exchange that is seared into my memory is me saying, “Look. What exactly is your problem here?!” He took a deep breath and said, “The problem, Mom, is YOU,” and launched into a recital of everything I had done wrong EVER. Going back about five years…

Zac: I can’t help but ask – how is the “home schooling” coming along? (I read you were writing stories now. Bravo!) Is it easier or harder than sitting in a classroom?

Well… It’s harder than sitting in a classroom but it’s a hell of a lot more fun! You see, sitting in a classroom, you just have to sit down, do your learning and for me sometimes watch the clock awaiting a science lesson, an art lesson or any lesson you prefer over the one you’re currently doing. However, when you’re home schooling, you’ve got to seek cover from loud music, find a desk, a chair and a decent place where you can easily concentrate on whatever you’re doing.

Troll Battle
Arty!!!!!

In normal school the lessons have a set order, a completely set order. The compass has motionless points. In home schooling you get to choose what you want to do and the order in which you do them. In unschooling you get to run your finger across pebbledash instead of being told how it feels. You get to take apart a phone and see how it works instead of being told about the mechanics of a Nokia.

You probably wouldn’t get a short lesson about gunboats and just go snorkeling to look at one when you’re at an average school! Plus, Mom downloaded some particle physics for me and I’ve hatched a new theory about the universe, that it’s just a computer programme designed by big, powerful, super-intelligent aliens.

However, when you’re doing home schooling, it’s just you, whoever’s teaching you and possibly a friend, cousin, brother or sister, and there’s no annoying classmate flicking Blu-tac at you or doing some idiotic stunt like sticking a clothes peg to their eyelash. Believe it or not our class clown Emre has done that.

Theodora: I asked Z for his opinion of the home-schooling thing. I’d like to hear your side as his teacher.

Obviously, world travel is a phenomenal context in which to discover history, RE, geography, the natural world… You learn things by exploring Angkor Wat, walking the Ho Chi Minh Trail, meeting Khmer Rouge survivors, snorkeling a World War II gunboat or diving a coral reef that would take aeons to learn in a classroom. I think the permutation of home-schooling we’re now trying works extremely well. We’re using a version of unschooling (I wrote about it here: Unschooling Rocks!), which means you allow children to learn what and when they want, rather than working with syllabuses and schedules.

No More Math
No, Please, Not Maths Again.

Z was a year or two ahead of the grade point average when we left the UK, so I can afford to be relaxed and experimental. He used to hate writing. He is now creating blog posts and chapter books, writing stories, planning stories, and doing a lot of art work to go with them. He reads well and is now discovering Dickens, which is brilliant.

But there are challenges. He’s quite technically minded and scientific. I did a single science subject to sixteen, twenty years ago. So responding to his learning desires involves a lot of learning on my side. He wants to do animating, and has played around with his Dad’s Flash animation software. So we’re getting a copy of that, which means I’ll have to learn with him on it. He has been talking about the Theory of Relativity a lot, and his objections to the Big Bang theory, and we’ve been learning about particle physics because he wanted to know what a positron was and how the Large Hadron Collider worked. We’ve been lucky enough to meet a lot of scientists as we travel, so that’s really helped.

Recently, he sat through my Open Water dive course and absorbed a lot of stuff about gases and pressures and percentages and decimals and fractions. So he learnt a lot there, too. Now he’s plotting the anatomy of a dragon and has been asking about the properties of gases so he can work out how their insides operate, the relationship between inertness and toxicity, and so on. So, I guess that’s my next challenge.

He’s also been teaching himself some French off Google Translate, coming out with random phrases from time to time. I’m trying to build on that when it comes up.

He is really into art, which presents another challenge. I can’t really draw, fold or sculpt, and, while you can do amazing things with found materials, like seashells, as we’re backpacking, it’s pretty much pencil, pen, crayon and paper.

Physically, it’s amazing how fluent he is compared to when we left. He was clowning around on a diveboat and someone said, “Well, he’ll either be a sailor or a particle physicist…” And I like learning myself, which is good. The downside is the amount I’m having to learn. Because I could walk the fourth and fifth grade syllabus’, and go a lot higher in the arts… But particle physics? On a beach?!

Zac: Of the places you’ve visited so far, do you have a favorite? If so, why?

Yes, I do have a favorite. Finland! I prefer skiing down a mountain to tropical cities. It helps that I’m capable of overheating before you could wave a ten-gallon hat and shout Yeehaw! Metaphorically speaking, of course.

Of course, if you’re talking about all the places on our holiday, so far my favourite would have to be the Philippines. As well as having Manila, which is a very nice city, there is the island of Marinduque, which boasts some hot springs, which have been converted into swimming pools and it also boasts a tamarind orchard. In the tamarind orchard you can find sweet tamarind trees, sour tamarind trees and one ridiculously sour tamarind tree. There is also a very nice hotel in Puerto Princesa City, which has its own kitchen, free room wifi, a little snackshop and hugely cheap fan rooms with well-maintained shared bathrooms. And of course there is the island-hopping and last of all some very good dive resorts.

Zac: Of the places you will be visiting, is there one you want to see the most? Again, if so, why?

…my cousins Eliza and Monique have their own pet chicken, which once laid a blue egg! We have also kept an egg secret in the hope that it will be brooded for long enough to hatch. Perhaps now it has hatched!

Australia! You see, I have cousins, grandparents and the like all living happily in Australia. I even have an uncle there. What’s more, my dad is Australian, which is why he’s coming out to meet us there. Also I am looking forward to Halloween, Christmas and my birthday, which are all conveniently close together, also my cousins Eliza and Monique have their own pet chicken, which once laid a blue egg! We have also kept an egg secret in the hope that it will be brooded for long enough to hatch. Perhaps now it has hatched!

Zac: What have you learned from this trip so far (life lessons, new feelings, discovering new things, eating bugs, etc.)?

Well, for starters, I have learnt divers’ sign language and emergency diving procedures. I have also learnt that due to the recent modernization televisions have become all the rage and now even the Lao minority tribes have them. In some countries, mainly Buddhist countries, it is considered hugely rude to put your foot up at someone.

I have learned that even if it freaks you out sometimes you can eat it because, as you asked, yes, I have eaten bugs, fried crickets, to be precise, and the other night I ate a delectable dish called sisig which consists of sizzling pig cheeks, ears and – yes, I know it’s kind of disgusting but it does taste nice – pig brains! You see, Asian cuisine has a 60 km difference between European or American Cuisine

Monitor Whiskey
Not the Most Drinkable…

The problem is that almost everywhere you go you cannot escape from commercial foods and global stereotypes. You see, we went to an island, which had a tribal village in it. These people lived very simply. Their diet consisted mainly of coconut, papaya and clams, and – would you believe it? Packet foods. I even found a sachet of Sunsilk conditioner! True story.

I have had some new feelings. One of the new feelings is the feeling where you feel like you’re a complete idiot. I first discovered this feeling when we were in a posh hotel in Thailand where each hotel room had a combination safe, four digit, and I cheekily locked my mom’s cigarettes in it.;-) I then attempted to write down the combination, realized I didn’t have a pen and started looking for one. While I was looking for one, however, I completely forgot the code!

The number one stereotype I hate is the stereotype that if you’re a kid your favourite sweet flavour is strawberry. Complete tripe. (Speaking of tripe, did you know tripe is Britain’s most hated food in the modern era?) Actually, I prefer sucking the juice out of lemons to eating that trash they call strawberry flavoured sweets.

Theodora: I also asked Z what he has learned from the trip so far. To date, what have you learned? Anything unexpected?

First and foremost, mooching… The joys of just wandering around, appreciating somewhere, sitting on the dock of the bay, and so on… It’s not something I’ve been good at historically, and I’ve learnt that through travel and my son. That’s a big discovery for me.

A close second? The wonders of diving. I don’t think I have a particular talent for it, but I do love it, and I’m contemplating qualifying as a scuba instructor.

Thirdly. How great are people?! I’ve never really doubted that the vast majority of people are good and kind. But our experiences on this trip, running from megalopolises to tribal villages and tiny islands, have really reinforced my belief in human nature.

Theodora: Now that you are 4+ months into this adventure, what advice do you have for parents (single or not) considering a similar travel experience?

Short Pants
Thank god he doesn’t know what cellulite is yet.

1: First and foremost: go for it. You will regret it if you don’t, because your kids are only children once.
2: When things go wrong, which they will, see the funny side.
3: Try not to fly too much. You get a lot more sense of a place by travelling slowly than you do by whizzing between airports. Plus it’s kinder to the environment.
4: Don’t over-schedule. If you’re planning an itinerary, leave plenty of days spare in it for just hanging out, enjoying stuff, staying a few extra days somewhere nice, going somewhere you’d never have heard of, etc. Adding a week to each month you plot off a map is a good rule of thumb.
5: Teach your kids to manage risk and strategies for dealing with environmental dangers.
6: Plan by the seasons but don’t plan exclusively for dry. Wet and cold can be interesting too.
7: Get decent backpacks for your kids. They are few and far between in the West and impossible to source in Asia.
8: Take more than one laptop to avoid turf wars. And stash movies on the children’s.
9: Sarongs are a godsend. They’re beach towels, bath towels, cover-ups, sheets, kiddie sleeping bags, and they weigh nothing and take up no space.
10: Zip-off trousers are two outfits for the weight of one.

Theodora: What is one thing you left at home (purposefully or by mistake) that you could really, really use right now?

Hmmmm… I am kicking myself for not buying, bringing and using a bona fide Drybag: they’re great as beach bags, too. I lost a camera to damp on the Mekong, plus two snorkel sets and a pair of Raybans off Koh Chang. Which means I am also missing the other pair of shades I didn’t bring!

Other than that? I would like to have family photos and old photos on my laptop now. Most of them are print, but I’m annoyed not to have transferred the digital ones. But, to be honest, in cities like Manila, Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur, Singapore, you can buy almost everything. I’m currently looking for a really robust camera. I’ve been through two in four months and just want something impossible to kill that’s good for scuba too.

Zac & Theodora: Can I check in with you again in a few months to see how it’s going?

Yes! (Zac)
I look forward to it! (Theodora)

You can follow Theodora and Zac at Travels with a Nine Year Old.

You can also follow Zac’s own blog at The 9-year-old strikes back.

Editor’s notes: All photographs courtesy of Theodora and Zac.


© Gretchen for TravelBlogs, 2010. |
Un-learning And Other Neat Stuff: An Interview With Theodora and Zac |
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Bodes Well

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Armed only with a restored 1971 VW Westfalia camper van, their 4 (now 5) year old son Bode, and maybe a bunch of needed equipment, the Rehm family – Angela and Jason – headed off to explore. Explore what, you may ask? Canada, U.S., Mexico and then just head south. Their mission: learn languages, volunteer and be inspired. There have been ups and downs but their journey continues.


© Gretchen for TravelBlogs, 2010. |
Bodes Well |
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